I’m getting turned in for Lawrence O’Donnell what is one of Donald Trump’s biggest denials about Russia may be unraveling tonight am in the civil war between the president and his former lawyer today the president last out at Michael Cohen after reports when is willing to tell Robert Mueller that Donald Trump knew in advance about the 2016 Trump Tower meeting for the Russians promise to deliver dirt on Hillary Clinton going to count with directly contradicts the president’s repeated denial that he knew nothing about that meeting Donald Trump tweeted this morning I did not know of the meeting with my son Don jr. sounds to me like someone is trying to make up stories in order to get himself out of an unrelated Jam Trump added the Cavs maybe an apparent reference to the federal investigation of Cohen the question now what did Donald Trump now the president story about the Trump Tower meeting has already shifted his lawyers claimed he was not involved in this falsely claiming the meeting was about adoption then they admitted in the memo that he dictated the statement now the strategy for Donald Trump is to attack Michael Cohen to boost the president’s credibility how to quote Barry Cohen according to the Daily Beast the first attempt did not go so well trying to claim that the longtime Trump organization lawyer as a liar I’m going been lying all week I mean referred to ignore me for years there’s nobody that I know that notion that hasn’t warmed me that if he the same Rudy Giuliani said this about Michael just a few months ago baby jumps at dangerous for Donald Trump Jr as it is the as it is for the president do you tell your father anything about though it was such a nothing Hannity it could be a crime though to lie to Congress and September Don Jr told the Senate Judiciary Committee that he quoted never discussed the meeting with his father today Democrat back before the committee to answer questions again in public regarding Cohen’s claims on the same day that we learned Michael Cohen May provide key evidence about potential collusion the New York Times reported that Robert Mueller is examining Donald Trump it says part of his wide-ranging obstruction in inquiry the times reports Miller is scrutinizing Trump tweeted attacks on attorney general Jeff sessions I’m going with a witness victim or an informant mean while the Wall Street Journal reported that the Trump organizations financed she has to testify before a former Trump organization employee told me Allen weisselberg quote knows where all the financial bodies are buried within the Trump organization interesting choice of words there is Jason Johnson Baltic Saboteur at the root.com also joining us Ruth markets Marcus Deputy editor page Deputy editorial page editor and columnist The Washington Post and Daniel Goldman DC contributors let’s start with you credibility is going to be the key portion here are the key takeaway Donald Trump has has repeatedly lied many would say he’s not trustworthy doesn’t have credibility because he worked for Donald Trump and I don’t know presumably he did things that were not truthful for Donald Trump or said things that were not truthful we don’t have a record lies or false if you want to use that work from Michael calling the only one roof that I can think of is that he told Chris Cuomo that he wasn’t recording him when he actually was that was a story that came out a couple days ago doing The credibility who is going to who do you think is going to have the have the upper hand in the credibility fight you have to ask a few questions one is who has the greater motive to lie here one of the things we’ve learned save from Robert Mueller is if you go to him at where is investigators with a false story and lie to them you’re going to get in a lot of trouble so if Michael Cohen is not telling the truth here because he’s looking for a deal from Robert Mueller and he peddles and untrue story he’s going to get himself into heap of trouble on the other hand president Trump has some motive here to lie because it would be a very big deal in fact if a he knew about this meeting and if he had been lie into the American people about it all along the second thing and Dan can speak to this is if you’ve got a witness who or somebody who may have some credibility problems you’re going to look for corroborating evidence what do the other people who allegedly heard this say what happened with those phone calls around the before and after the meeting to the block number who were they what was Don Juniors practice in terms of telling things to his so it’s not a simple he said he said swearing contest you can bring another fax to buttress your case in to figure out who you should believe here they know what else would they look for That’s The credibility of someone is generally people don’t lie against their self-interest so if Michael Cohen were to get on the stand and he were to admit to all sorts of wrongdoing and crimes and he were to say and by the way these other people did those with me you credit somebody like that because he’s admitting to his own criminal conduct if he saying oh I’m putting the finger at somebody else I didn’t do it then that’s speaking in your own self-interest and there is more motive to lie he’s more of a valuable informant or or operator I should say against Donald Trump with the special counsel or the FDNY if he’s more valuable to cut a deal with rather than somebody just to so it’s interesting because we love this you know we’re sitting on television and Michael Cohen is saying this normally only happens in a courtroom when there’s cross-examination and someone calls the cooperating witness a liar 8 almost never happens in public and the reason is because most cooperating Witnesses are Guided by their lawyers and they know to be quiet it in public Michael Cohen if he’s acting in his self-interest will be quiet because this is not helping him at all yes he’s not helping his caused by doing this and to your point about oh let’s flag this for the sdny or for Mueller that I have this information he doesn’t have to do that in public he has an incredibly able and capable experienced lawyer who is very used to having these conversations with prosecutors that’s the proper way to do it the way he’s doing this in public is only hurting him certainly in public here’s a new report from Emily Jane Fox the Vanity Fair there is an increasing sense inside Cohen world that Trump’s former attorney is ready to torch the man he wants bad to take a bullet for telling lies about a quote Trove of material that he could unleash to create headaches for Trump there’s a lot more to come he has said there is a lot Jason what do you think of that what most people would Common Sense would have assumed about President Trump anyway remember consigliere this guy was his fixer it is highly likely that that has also too dangerous information about him that he can reveal in the reason this is playing out in public between Museum the other day because none of these men regardless of what their technical positions are whether that’s president a lawyer for the president or Laura protecting the South during an investigation team to really respect the rule of law or the Norms of having investigation is supposed to happen where that Trump Tower lawyer the meeting that there was between Don Jr and and the Russian lawyer Natalia veselnitskaya the Kremlin then she claims to be she was a ghost rider for top Russian government lawyers and receive key is this from the interior Ministry in a case involving a client I mean she’s not being honest about her connections to the Kremlin there was there were problems with the initial statement about what was actually happening we’re meeting Donald Trump saying it nothing to do with it and then it coming out from his lawyers that he actually dictated that statement what else are we going to learn we can’t wait to find out but you know we were told in the original cetacean to Donald Trump jr. precisely who she was she was identified as a Russian government lawyer who was offering information about Hillary Clinton because the Russian government Donald Trump jr. was told wanted to see Donald Trump elected president don’t need more than that what would a responsible patriotic person do in a situation like that they would call the FBI at the very least they would say no thank you what have we had this meeting we ended what what do we know Donald Trump help to orchestrate a lie about it when it was discovered then he lied and his people lied his lawyers lied about whether he was involved in or training that lie so now we need to find out is he lying or telling the truth about whether he knew about the meeting at the time we also have something but anniversary to celebrate it’s now 2 years to the day that Donald Trump at the find Hillary Clinton’s missing 30,000 emails and then I had this exchange with him let’s look Russia if you’re listening I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 females that are missing or any of the country has those emails into the Trump campaign and what they had to do with Russia because of that exchange because people in the intelligence Community were like what what is going on why is he saying that scooters are trained not to believe in coincidences and that doesn’t mean that they they don’t exist but that you’re always skeptical of coincidences so when you see him say something like that and then it later materializes that Russia actually did have those emails you naturally ask yourself what did he know and that will be that is I’m sure a big significant Focus update of the investigation but the same is true with this Kitty I ate a definitive connection if there’s going to be internal emails memos text messages there’s all sorts of documentary evidence and in this day and age with Communications and that will also be the case as relates to this Trump Tower meeting when Trump promises a big speech on Hillary Clinton that is supposed to follow this meeting and then the meeting is a fail and that speech never have the same kind of thing is going on in both instances bird and the rest of MSNBCDonald Trump denied Michael Cohen’s reported claim that Trump knew in advance of the Trump Tower meeting with Russians, as Trump allies plot to “bury” Cohen. Ruth Marcus says Trump’s “motive to lie” boosts Cohen’s credibility. Daniel Goldman and Jason Johnson join Katy Tur.
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Donald Trump/Michael Cohen Face Off: What Does He Know? | The Last Word | MSNBC